Last week’s post about the possibility of NSA targeting JFK Web sites for “cognitive infiltration”–and the NSA’s refusal to respond to questioning–was the most popular story of the week, followed closely by Rick Bauer’s recollections of his friend David Ferrie.
Gail Raven’s ever-popular recollections about her friend Jack Ruby fell to third place.
And the winners are:
1) NSA target JFK Web sites? They won’t answer the question (Feb. 27, 2014)
3) Ex-flame says Jack Ruby ‘had no choice’ but to kill Oswald (March 21, 2013)
4) James Tague, key JFK assassination wtiness, dies (March 2, 2014)
5) Crowdsourcing JFK: Madeleine Brown debunked (March 4, 2014)
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Ruby’s sex life and preferences were investigated by the FBI but I think the question of whether he preferred men over women remains inconclusive. It’s interesting that some lone nut theorists like Gerald Posner have jumped on the “Ruby was Gay” rumor despite the fact that there’s very little evidence that he was.
Here’s an excerpt from a Dallas Voice article on the subject:
In 1992, the National Archives provided access to Ruby’s FBI files. At various times, FBI agents were ordered by the headquarter’s brass to investigate Ruby’s subversive activities and whether he had homosexual tendencies or other “sex perversions.”
Did Wall think Ruby was gay?
LUNCHEON DATES: Wall, and Jack Ruby regularly dined at The Copper Cow. But Wall says they were never roommates.
“No. I don’t think he liked men. Besides, he was too fucking ugly. There was a woman, but I don’t think they ever had sex. Who would dare? Jack was too concerned about Jack Ruby to be interested in anyone else,” Wall says. “But I liked Jack. He was entertaining. He didn’t have many friends, though. I think he was used to being alone and he was a little sad about it. I thought there was something good about him. But I also knew he was dangerous.”
http://www.dallasvoice.com/rubys-gaydar-reading-1018336.html
Is there hard evidence that Ruby was gay? Apart from Rose Cheramie’s allegation I haven’t as yet seen the proof of this assertion. Please elucidate fellow posters? Thanks.
If, as the headline of this thread suggests, this is Data Driven Journalism, then why hasn’t the topic of Ruby’s murder of Oswald received more attention on this site beyond the ex-flame article? Why have there not been follow up stories relating to for instance, the McKeown / Ruby and McKeown / Oswald and McKeown / Porter angles? Where is the discussion about these and other alleged connections shared by Oswald and Ruby? Why aren’t there more headlines on this site relating to that angle of the investigation, particularly in light of the success of the “ex-flame” headline? Absent a more concentrated focus on Ruby’s murder of Oswald, considered in context of far more significant stories that have been featured on this site, I contend that the popularity of the “ex-flame” story could well be attributed to the provocative photograph. What I cannot figure out is how does one ‘google’ jfkfacts sexy photos?
How was it established that Gail Raven was Ruby’s girlfriend or that she actually knew anything about Ruby’s motive? Did she ever claim that Ruby told her or was she simply expressing her opinion about why he shot Oswald?
According to several FBI reports on maryferrell.org, Gail Raven was living in Corpus Christi on 11/22/63 and apparently hadn’t been working in Dallas since mid-June. Her friend Lois Weeks told the FBI that Gail had once remarked that Ruby was in the Mafia. Gail denied saying it, but added that she’d heard that rumor “around the clubs.”
https://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=10489&relPageId=377
I’d ask the same about Veciana. Actual knowledge or opinion? He claimed he saw “Bishop” with Oswald, but other than that he seems to be presenting the usual CT talking points rather than any inside info about a CIA plot to kill JFK. One could almost guess which books he’s read.
Even witnesses have opinions about the JFK assassination, just like everybody else. What *evidence* did these two witnesses present?
“Did she ever claim that Ruby told her or was she simply expressing her opinion about why he shot Oswald?”
It seems like anti-Conspiracy researchers place a ton of value in Character witnesses’ “opinions” when they incriminate Oswald or support the conclusion that Ruby’s shooting Oswald was impulsive and not part of a conspiracy.
Do you find any value in the opinions of Character witnesses that express the view that Ruby had underworld ties and might have been ordered to shoot Oswald?
I agree that “opinions” alone don’t prove(or rule out) a conspiracy. However, it seems like the anti-Conspiracy side has no problem with the opinions of Character witnesses when it fits their narrative.
I think the net value in Raven’s story is that some who personally knew Ruby DID have knowledge of or suspect that he had underworld ties. I’m also aware that there were others who knew Ruby who didn’t believe he was involved in any underworld dealings.
I wonder if one reason John McAdams gets so many views is because the search engines give him top billing, and the TV networks give him only billing, while critiques of his comments only reach a tiny number of viewers on websites that allow both sides on.
There is no public sphere for a real debate on the Kennedy Assassination. John Simkin’s generic comments about “JFK researchers” are, IMO misguided. The real problem is a deck so stacked it’s like Siberia with better public relations, in terms of favoring government propaganda.
The problem with this whole scenario is the unspoken fact that Ruby was gay.
Photon,
You assert Ruby was gay. I suspect he was.
Does the assertion he was gay diminish the value of Gail Raven’s statements?
Absolutely.
I guess your reasoning is that because Ruby was gay and because Gail Raven says he wanted to marry her, we are not to believe any of what she says.
I ask in return, who is so perfect that he or she never lies, never embellishes?
Gail Raven’s statement about Ruby’s wanting to marry her adds sizzle; at worst, it’s a harmless embellishment. What’s important is what she says about Ruby’s motive for killing Oswald.
All the videotape I’ve seen of Ruby’s dancers confirm that Ruby was good to his dancers; treated them well, within the context of the times and environment. The dancers liked Ruby, got to know him. The famous photo of Ruby in his office with three smiling dancers suggests a quite cordial relationship between Ruby and his dancers.
In these circumstances, it’s easy to believe one or more of the dancers who knew Ruby and knew of his associations might come to the same conclusion as Gail Raven.
I’m not asserting Gail Raven is correct. I’m open-minded on that. But I will say, based on what’s known, it’s unfair to assert she’s a liar.
I think it may be possible he was bi-sexual. I remember reading in one of the books from the 80’s I believe a statement that at a party at a neighbors apartment he said “I’ll take on anyone here, man or woman”.
In that day and time he would have kept up a front in certain circles. Very few came out of the closet back then. That he would have had a possibly not real passionate ongoing relationship with a beautiful woman for the sake of prestige and the “respectability’ or class he was known to long for is not inconceivable.
It was spoken about by Rose Cheramie and Carlos Marcello