Another defense of Bill O’Reilly: ‘I have no explanation’

As far as I know I am the only blogger who was written in “In Defense of Bill O’Reilly” when it comes to one of his more egregious fibs. But now I am not alone.

Courtesy of Erik Wemple and the Washington Post:  a defender of O’Reilly stands up for the embattled Fox News host and denies that he told a JFK whopper — sort of.

37 comments

  1. It’s pretty much impossible to believe that George DeMohrenschildt was murdered after reading all of the sources (including his own wife and daughter) that say he was on the brink of committing suicide for at least a year prior to his death—and that he HAD, in fact, attempted suicide FOUR separate times in the year 1976 alone (which means he tried to kill himself BEFORE the HSCA was even formed). More….

    http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2015/03/george-demohrenschildt-suicide.html

    • Ronnie Wayne says:

      David, de Mohrenschild’s death deserved and still deserves further investigation. Regarding the “Beep’s”, attributed to house workers entering and exiting when they occurred, the Coroner told Mark Lane first, in response to his question of it, then the Coroners jury (“when one said that sounds like my alarm”), “we are not going into that”.
      The chief investigator for the police told Fonzi or somebody the suicide was “questionable” or “suspicous”.. The tape records footsteps coming and going yet George was found in sock feet.
      I’d always thought for some reason the suicide occurred in “his’ bedroom. A post on this site says it was in the hall outside Tilton’s bedroom. Odd if true.
      Last, O’Riley on the front step heard the shot that a maid or cook suntanning by the pool, a gardener watering, and a maid inside the house did not.
      His wife didn’t believe it was suicide either.

    • leslie sharp says:

      David vonPein … after years of failed suicide attempts, George deMohrenshildt waited for the perfect, opportune time this one last time, just after noon in broad daylight in the home of his former sister-in-law who was also hosting his beloved daughter Alexandra and her young friend who undoubtedly could come upon his corpse and be scarred for life. Having just earned $1,000 of a $4,000 fee for a four day interview, George became spontaneously, suicidally despondent, borrowed a long gage shotgun from the Tilton’s, sat down and shot himself in the mouth. Yep. And he did this while intrepid Dallas ABC-WFAA (Ted Dealey, Belo Corporation) reporter Bill O’Reilly stood on the doorsteps of the Tilton Mansion … doing what? Was Bill ringing the door bell, was he knocking on the window panes, was he shuffling around wondering whether or not anyone was home? When he heard the shots did Bill rush into the house? How did deM arrive at the Mansion, how did Bill arrive at the Mansion, where were their rental cars, or if neither had cars and used taxis, where is the testimony of the taxi drivers? Where are the police records that reference one “Bill O’Reilly, star reporter” at the scene of the crime? Where is the record of the report Bill filed that day with WFAA, the ‘scoop’ … “I just heard the actual gun shots of George deMohrenshildt’s suicide.” Fool me once, DvP …..

      • Leslie,

        You’re preaching to the choir when discussing Bill O’Reilly’s obvious (and provable) lie about being at DeMohrenschildt’s door when the gun went off. Everybody now knows that WAS a lie. There’s no question about that fact. This phone call verifies the lie….

        https://app.box.com/s/wffmqabeig0qg1m3h3myj32mki04q0fd

        But O’Reilly’s big fat lie certainly doesn’t mean George DeMohrenschildt was murdered by someone on March 29, 1977. Does it, Leslie?

        So, you think Jeanne DeMohrenschildt lied through her teeth when she told investigator Thomas Neighbors that her husband had tried to kill himself FOUR separate times in the year 1976?

        Did the alleged “conspiracy” and “cover-up” stretch all the way to Jeanne DeMohrenschildt (and George’s daught Alexandra) too?

        • leslie sharp says:

          David,
          What do you read into his lie that he was on the doorstep and heard gunshots … does he follow with, “and I rushed inside to determine the source?” “I rushed to a phone and called the police?” “someone had called the police and I stuck around like any good reporter would to report the details of the death” “I decided to leave and find out what happened later?” “I didn’t see anyone flee the scene?” “I didn’t chase after anyone?” “I made a statement to the police?” O’Reilly is reinforcing the official story “it was suicide.” But he is being extremely careful not to elaborate on his presence. I find that curious. His lie does not prove deMohrenschildt was murdered; his lie persuades tens of millions of Americans, including a new generation that knows little about the assassination, that deM was indeed not murdered. Case closed, right?

          People with psychiatric conditions often attempt suicide – often as a cry for help with no real intention of succeeding. The question is what was the source of deM’s psychiatric condition? And why so many failed attempts but he was successful in Manalapan where his daughter would be confronted with his deed and on the eve of testifying before the HSCA?

          “Did the alleged “conspiracy” and “cover-up” stretch all the way to Jeanne DeMohrenschildt (and George’s daught Alexandra) too?”

          Of course you are kidding.

          • David Hazan says:

            Oh, Leslie… You are so cynical… Can a poor journalist not lie about the questionable suicide of THE key witness of THE most significant event of the century, on the eve of his pending testimony, without you reading in to it with your crazy conspiracy theories????

            ;-}]

          • What’s so hard to believe about a mentally unstable person, who had attempted suicide multiple times in the past year and who might have placed upon himself some guilt pertaining to Lee Harvey Oswald’s decision to kill the President, becoming suicidal once again when he dwells upon what loomed ahead for him — i.e., having to testify about his relationship with Lee Harvey Oswald all over again — which apparently had become a subject that caused Mr. DeMohrenschildt considerable grief and internal anguish over the years since 1963.

            Given DeMohrenschildt’s past history of suicidal tendencies and his alleged inner guilt that he may have felt in possibly (in his own mind) saying or doing something that could have caused Oswald to commit his heinous act on 11/22/63, it doesn’t surprise me in the least that George picked the date of March 29th, 1977, to place that shotgun in his mouth.

            You see, it’s all a matter of perspective.

          • David Hazan says:

            “You see, it’s all a matter of perspective.” – David Von Pein

            I understand. But the perspective you presented is an extremely narrow one.

          • DAVID HAZAN SAID:

            I understand. But the perspective you presented is an extremely narrow one.

            DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

            But given GdM’s known mental history, it’s also the most *logical* and *reasonable* perspective, too. (IMO)

          • leslie sharp says:

            David vonPein, if George deMohrenschildt had been in a car accident and it was determined that he was negligent and had caused the wreck, and months later he was in another accident and determined to have been negligent (you see where I’m going?) and months later he’s in a fourth accident and he dies …….. should investigators reviewing his past automatically presume he caused the fourth wreck or should there be a thorough investigation of that specific wreck? Years ago I studied the reports for a number of weeks and came to the conclusion that given the number of holes in the investigation someone handed the police the psychiatrist’s records and the case was closed prematurely.

          • David Hazan says:

            The reason I called it narrow is that it does not take in to consideration anything else about who he was, what he was, what was happening to him at the time, and all of the peripheral events in an effort to create a “mentally unstable” narrative that is not impossible, but nonetheless not so probable.

            As Leslie points out, it is not necessarily what GdM did, but more what investigators and law enforcement did NOT do after the suicide that does not pass the smell test.

            In addition, according to researcher Bruce Adamson, GdM was administered 9 sessions of electroshock “therapy” at Parkland hospital during the period before his suicide. (he claims to have hospital records to back his claim)

            It is also worth noting that his long time friend/partner/accomplice GHWBush had left his post as the director of CIA just two months earlier. This is purely speculation on my part, but this might have lifted a certain level of protection GdM was enjoying until then.

            Also, the incoming director, Stan Turner, was tasked with doing a wiggle dance by testifying and convincing the world that the MKUltra program existed, but had long been terminated.The chances are that Turner was chosen to do the job because of his involvement and expertise in the program to begin with. Which brings us back to the nine electroshock “treatments” and what their nature might have been. (I took some shortcuts here for the purposes of this post, but the chainlink fence of deceit from GdM to the CIA is quite a solid one)

            So, had GdM been an unhappy and boring bank clerk living in a suburb of Dallas, there would be nothing to this suicide, which could easily be explained away with a “depressed” and “mentally unstable” framework. But for a man like GdM, a company man of international intrigue, espionage, under the table oil deals, etc., who happened to be Oswald’s main CIA connection, it is a flimsy and cherry picked explanation at best.

            I can’t help mention that his “alleged guilt”, if true, was a lot more likely to be for much, much heavier burdens than just “pertaining to Lee Harvey Oswald’s decision to kill the President”… Which, as a masterfully short phrase, implies not only LHO “decided” on his own, but did kill the president, once again, all on his own. So, I commend you for its wording.. But what it says is utter nonsense.

          • Good post, David Hazan (at 11:00 AM EDT on March 14). Thank you.

            There are always two sides to every story. Otherwise, sites like this one would not even exist.

            But the fact remains that Mr. DeMohrenschildt was almost certainly suffering from mental instability in the years 1976 and 1977 shortly before his death. And he had (per his wife) attempted to kill himself on multiple occasions in just the previous year (1976) alone — and some of those attempts would have occurred almost certainly PRIOR to the formation of the HSCA (i.e., before George DeM. could have known he was going to have to testify in front of another U.S. Government committee investigating JFK’s murder).

            So, in my view, the “suicide” conclusion presents itself as the probable truth in DeMohrenschildt’s case.

            Are there conspiracy theorists out there who really think the “plot” or “cover-up” went so far as to merely STAGE or FAKE multiple alleged suicide attempts on the part of George DeMohrenschildt, and then the plotters managed to get the victim’s wife and daughter to lie about those suicide attempts to the investigators after his death?

            Am I *really* expected to think that a cover-up plot extended to those lengths?

            And if Jeanne DeM. was telling the truth, I am *really* supposed to believe that a man who had tried to kill himself at least four times in the recent past was actually murdered—even though all signs point to the man taking his own life?

            In my opinion, it’s those PAST attempts at suicide that spell doom for the conspiracy theorists who want to believe George DeMohrenschildt was murdered.

          • leslie sharp says:

            David vonPein, again I ask you if your argument solely rests on George deMohrenschildt’s previous attempts to kill himself? If so, I would point out that he had endured electro-shock therapy administered at Parkland by the way in the interim.

            Years ago I studied the police reports for a number of weeks and came to the conclusion that given the number of holes in the investigation someone handed the police the psychiatrist’s records and the case was closed prematurely. Surely you didn’t stop your own pursuit of the truth there?

          • DeMohrenschildt’s “psychiatric problems” seem to center around a certain, Charles Mendoza, who George initially went to for a relapse of his chronic bronchitis. Someone recommended Mendoza who was new to the area. George began “treatments” at Mendoza’s office rather than go to a hospital.
            Although his bronchitis got better, he began to become more nervous and agitated emotionally.
            Jean became concerned and asked what these “treatments” were, and George said he was given shots, and a regimen of pills.

            I think this would indicate that George may have been in the hands of MK Ultra, who were able to “treat” him in such a way as to drive him to the edge.
            His early attempts at suicide were by taking overdoses of the pills.
            http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/Weisberg%20Subject%20Index%20Files/M%20Disk/Mack%20Gary%20Cover-up/Item%2025.pdf
            \\][//

          • LESLIE SHARP SAID:

            David vonPein [sic; is there any particular reason why you are deliberately misspelling my name in every post you direct toward me? ~shrug~], again I ask you if your argument solely rests on George deMohrenschildt’s previous attempts to kill himself?

            DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

            Mostly, yes.

            We’ve got a mentally disturbed man who has tried to kill himself on *numerous* prior occasions in the last year or two. And this same man then ends up dead of an apparent suicide (with no signs whatsoever of foul play connected with his demise), and yet I’m supposed to think he was murdered instead of taking his own life? That seems mighty silly to me. But I guess most conspiracy theorists like “murder” better than “Occam”.

            LESLIE SHARP SAID:

            If so, I would point out that he had endured electro-shock therapy administered at Parkland by the way in the interim.

            DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

            Which only *further* indicates the victim’s deteriorating mental condition. How many people undergo electroshock therapy just for the fun of it?

            Or should I think the “electroshock” stuff is all just a lie too? As well as DeMohrenschildt’s multi-week confinement in Parkland’s psychiatric ward?

            You’re practically making my point for me, Leslie.

            George DeMohrenschildt had severe mental problems, as the “electroshock” treatment vividly illustrates.

          • “A check with the Dallas County Medical Society showed that a Dr. Charles Mendoza had registered with the association just two months before he began treating George DeMohrenschildt. Mendoza left Dallas in December 1976, shortly after George had entered Parkland for mental problems. Mendoza’s forwarding address proved fictitious.” ~Ibid
            \\][//

          • “Which only *further* indicates the victim’s deteriorating mental condition. How many people undergo electroshock therapy just for the fun of it?”~David Von Pein

            Yes indeed, who would “volunteer” for torture such as electroshock therapy?

            Surely you are not serious David. This brutal treatment is not voluntary, ad this barbaric “treatment” to the regimen of drugs this quack
            “Dr” Mendoza was previously loading him up on, and you have the recipe of turning a mind to mush.
            This is reminiscent the “psychiatric” treatments of the gulags of the Soviet Union.
            DeMohrenschildt may have been lucky to escape having a frontal lobotomy. I say “may” because he obviously went through intense psychiatric torture.
            Dr Mengele’s ghost still haunts the planet.
            \\][//

          • leslie sharp says:

            David Von Pein, mea culpa and I sincerely mean that. It was not intentional. I have seen your name elsewhere and somehow registered it the way I have been spelling it. Again, my apologies.

            “We’ve got a mentally disturbed man who has tried to kill himself on *numerous* prior occasions in the last year or two. And this same man then ends up dead of an apparent suicide (with no signs whatsoever of foul play connected with his demise), and yet I’m supposed to think he was murdered instead of taking his own life? That seems mighty silly to me. But I guess most conspiracy theorists like “murder” better than “Occam”.”

            What you think is actually not germane to the investigation into the death of George deMohrenschildt; the argument is that the local authorities jumped to the conclusion you have without a thorough investigation. If memory serves, their investigation process lasted approx. one week perhaps ten days. As I said, when they were handed a psychiatrist’s report, they concluded the investigation and spent several days tidying up the paper work. If you as a bystander albeit an interested one want to conclude your personal inquiry with that psychiatric report, you’re entitled. However those responsible for investigating the death of a key witness preparing to testify in the high profile, public re-examination of the Kennedy assassination should have been held to a higher standard.

            “Which only *further* indicates the victim’s deteriorating mental condition. How many people undergo electroshock therapy just for the fun of it?”

            And who authorized the electroshock? (pls note Willy Whitten’s recent revelation about a Doctor Mendoza at Parkland). What were deMohrenschildt’s symptoms to warrant such extreme measures? Or do you advocate that ECT is the only protocol for depression or possibly more accurate in deM’s case, overwhelming anxiety and fear?

            You are practically making my case for me David. Indeed deM was being assaulted, and I posit Willem Oltman’s could provide the details. Occam has been overworked in this decades old debate. Tell a magician that the more simple the trick the more effective. Or consider the anti razor, “If three things are not enough to verify an affirmative proposition about things, a fourth must be added.”

          • David Hazan says:

            ”Which only *further* indicates the victim’s deteriorating mental condition. How many people undergo electroshock therapy just for the fun of it?” – David Von Pein.

            I recommend you brush up on the subject of MKUltra. According to CIA’s own FOIA documents, the program was able to create multiple mind controlled subjects who cooperated with each other in carrying out a very precise plan without knowing each other before, during, or after the mission. Through the use of electroshock and drugs, they were also able to induce a split personality, where the alternate personality would perform acts that the other is not aware of or remember. (2xSirhan)

            Even though it is fully documented, MK Ultra still receives the tinfoil hat treatment from people and is always left out of “proper/academic/intellectual” discussions.

            As Willy Whitten illustrates perfectly in his post above, GdM seems to have been “handled” quite a bit before his suicide.

            And on the forensic side of things… There is this peculiar recording, said to be made to record soap operas while the lady of the house was out playing bridge. I am not certain what to make of it. The two maids in the house at the time testify not having heard the gunshot, but somebody (a female) goes into the room seconds after and lets out a huge scream. I haven’t been able to establish for sure who this person was. Does anyone know?

          • WILLY WHITTEN SAID:

            Yes indeed, who would “volunteer” for torture such as electroshock therapy?

            Surely you are not serious David. This brutal treatment is not voluntary…

            LESLIE SHARP SAID:

            And who authorized the electroshock? (please note Willy Whitten’s recent revelation about a Doctor Mendoza at Parkland).

            DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

            Oh, I see. So now a certain “Dr. Mendoza” is part of the plot to cover-up the true facts about President Kennedy’s assassination by FORCING George DeMohrenschildt to undergo electroshock treatments against George’s will. Is that it?

            And George could do NOTHING to stop this “torture”, right? Mr. DeM., just like Lee Harvey Oswald (if we’re to believe some of the conspiracy theorists out there), was merely a puppet on a string, with absolutely no will of his own. Oswald and DeMohrenschildt apparently had no ability whatsoever to fight back against the evil conspiratorial forces that surrounded each of them.

            “Mr. DeMohrenschildt, we want to give you several electroshock treatments to turn your brain to mush. That’s okay with you, isn’t it George?”

            “Hey Lee! You don’t mind carrying this long paper package into the Book Depository Building on the morning of November 22, 1963, do you? You don’t need to know what’s in the package, just be a good sport and let Buell Frazier see you walk into the back door of the building with it. And tell Buell it contains curtain rods or something like that. Okay, buddy? Thanks!”

            Quick Quiz….

            How many totally subservient puppets and slaves are needed to create a good-looking cover-up operation associated with the death of a U.S. President?

            Answer….

            Unknown. (The conspiracy theorists are still trying to figure it out, as they add more and more obedient servants to their makle-believe JFK conspiracy every year.)

          • leslie sharp says:

            David Von Pein, you continue to deflect the argument from the salient issue. I remember now that the timeline of the investigation indicates the police took a weekend and another day perhaps two to process the report leaving approximately 96 hours for a serious investigation. This in spite of their knowing that deM was a key witness scheduled to testify before a Kennedy related inquiry.

            Our discussion ensued when Jeff Morley brought attention to Bill O’Reilly’s “fib” of 2012 on the eve of the 50th anniversary suggesting he was standing on the front doorstep of the Tilton Mansion when he heard the sound of gun shots. Unless it has been withheld, O’Reilly never made a statement to the police, and he has yet to elaborate on the experience other than to establish on the subtlest level there was no criminal activity in play that afternoon.

            From there you attempted to deflect the conversation from Bill O’Reilly’s lie to deMohrenschildt’s mental or lack thereof stability.

            Will you now speak to the specifics of the investigation into deMohrenschildt’s death and to Bill O’Reilly’s lie? If not, my conversation with you is concluded.

          • LESLIE SHARP SAID:

            Will you now speak to the specifics of the investigation into deMohrenschildt’s death and to Bill O’Reilly’s lie? If not, my conversation with you is concluded.

            DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

            O’Reilly’s lie, of course, has nothing whatsoever to do with the subject we’ve been talking about here — i.e., whether or not George DeMohrenschildt was murdered or committed suicide.

            The police officer who investigated DeMohrenschildt’s death for the Palm Beach Sheriff’s Office said this in his report. If you want to ignore these words, that’s your choice:

            “This writer’s investigation has failed to produce any evidence which would tend to indicate that the victim met his death by any means other than by his own hand. All of the facts indicate that he was a disturbed man, who, at the time of his death, was suffering from the same overwhelming mental pressures which must have surely prompted his four prior suicide attempts, in Texas, in 1976. This death investigation is, therefore, declared to be a suicide and is hereby EXCEPTIONALLY CLEARED.” — Detective Thomas Neighbors; Sheriff’s Office, Palm Beach County, Florida

            http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/death2.txt

          • leslie sharp says:

            “O’Reilly’s lie, of course, has nothing whatsoever to do with the subject we’ve been talking about here — i.e., whether or not George DeMohrenschildt was murdered or committed suicide.”

            David V P: if you are not going to respond to my challenge that O’Reilly’s claim attempts to establish on the most subtle of levels that there was no nefarious activity around the Tilton Mansion as he stood on the doorstep, then as I said, we are at an impasse.

            You revert yet again to the argument “deMohrenschildt as disturbed men” to explain the lack of a thorough investigation into his death. Your argument relies on a report that declares “Exceptionally Cleared” rather than the more definitive ‘Case Closed.’ I remember finding that suspicious when I was reviewing the investigation records.

            You can keep repeating the rant about deMohrenschildt: “who, at the time of his death, was suffering from the same overwhelming mental pressures which must have surely prompted his four prior suicide attempts, in Texas, in 1976,” but those paying attention will hone in on your “must have been” buried in your definitive claim. Funny how these phrases recur when lone nut theorists are pressed to explain the omissions, disinformation and misinformation in any investigation: “mistaken,’ ‘ human frailty,’ ‘must have been.’

            Quite seriously, who are you trying to buffalo here? There was no investigation into deMohrenschildt’s death. A rubber stamp of ‘death by one’s own hand,’ was applied over a period of 96 hours, and there is not one shred of data to indicate investigators considered, let alone went in search of facts to prove otherwise.

        • David Hazan says:

          That’s a valid argument, David.

          Any idea what the method of suicide was in the previous four failed attempts?

          And do we know whether or not Mrs. M had told anyone about these attempts prior to the fifth successful attempt?

          The deM family were in the thick of the cold war espionage game, the nature and extent of which is still being debated. In that sense, it wouldn’t be such a farfetched idea to think that Mrs M might have distorted some truths in order to protect herself and her family from the risk of further harassment, or outright elimination….

          But, that said, I have no reason to believe that George posed any danger to a probable assassination conspiracy in terms of spilling the beans. In all the interviews I have seen deM talk, he is playing his part perfectly and lying through his teeth about Oswald, his relationship with him, as well as his thoughts on Oswald’s motive and psychology…

          That is unless the reporter who was interviewing him right before his death was on to something we don’t know about. And we probably won’t know about.

          Did you ever listen to the recording of the moment deM was meant to have pulled the trigger? Apparently, at his sister’s house, they would record the sound of soap operas off the TV… One can clearly hear the gunshot over the stream of soap dialogue, and subsequently her sister finding the body and screaming.

          There’s a second hand account of what the Reader’s Digest interviewer Ed Epstein said about the incident here

          I will also post an excerpt from that page as a separate reply:

        • David Hazan says:

          Excerpt from a second hand account of Ed Epstein’s interview with deM on the day of his death:

          “Ed was commissioned by Reader’s Digest to write some story on the JFK assassination, and so he was interviewing a bunch of people for the article. Apparently, Reader’s Digest was paying well for this article. Ed had lined up a few days of interviews with George De Mohrenschildt. George needed money and Ed (thanks to the Reader’s Digest largess) was able to pay him a bit.

          Ed was conducting the interviews and along to help him was an assistant. After a long morning of interviews, they decided to break for lunch. George left to go back to his sister’s?? house (where ever he was staying at the time) for lunch, and when he left, he left his address book behind. Ed picked up the address book and showed it to his assistant, and they had a brief conversation about what to do about the address book. Then, two minutes later, there was a knock at the door. Ed said he knew exactly what the knock was. He said he knew it was George coming back to get the address book. So Ed went to the door, address book in hand and wordlessly handed it to George, who went off to lunch.

          Ed described George and being tense, anxious and fearful, but not depressed. According to Ed, George seemed fine, maybe a bit tired after a long morning of interviewing. During his lunch break, George was fatally shot. His death was reported as a suicide, but given that he was about to testify before congress and he seemed to be somewhat talkative, there is a pretty good chance he was killed to silence him.

          George did not come back to interview with Ed, but the police and local district attorney came after the death. Ed said that the only thing that the district attorney (Ed wasn’t 100% sure that it was a DA, but it was a local official and not police) wanted to know was about the address book. Ed said that he and his assistant were repeated questioned about where they had the address book, but they were asked few other questions.

          The implication of this is that Ed’s hotel room (I think that is where they were conducting the interviews) was bugged, and that someone was listening in on his interviews.”

          • Ramon F Herrera says:

            “Apparently, Reader’s Digest was paying well for this article.”

            ========================

            Not really. Not for a man at that economic/social level.

            “At that point, I offered him a $1,000 a day for a 4-day interview. ”

            http://spartacus-educational.com/JFKdemohrenschildt.htm

          • leslie sharp says:

            David Hazan, do you have the name of the person recalling this?

            “Ed described George and being tense, anxious and fearful, but not depressed. According to Ed, George seemed fine, maybe a bit tired after a long morning of interviewing. During his lunch break, George was fatally shot. His death was reported as a suicide, but given that he was about to testify before congress and he seemed to be somewhat talkative, there is a pretty good chance he was killed to silence him.”

            Assuming this is a credible account of what Epstein said, are you still convinced as is David vonPein that deMohrenschildt committed suicide? If Epstein’s portrayal of George’s state of mind is accurate and not purely subjective, that would mean that deM either had a spontaneous attack of despondency when he reached the Tilton Mansion, or something between the time he left the Breakers and arrived inside the home triggered him (no pun intended) to kill himself, or he was murdered. Bill O’Reilly’s account of being on the doorstep at the time of the gunshots should clear up some of these questions … yet he has not been forthcoming with the details of those minutes following the gunshots. Why is not one pressuring him to elaborate? However, he did succeed in establishing in the mind set of his fans and audience that no one fled the scene – it’s subtle, but the inference is there. Apparently O’Reilly felt no need to report the details of the incident, they were peripheral. How does one build a career in journalism with those ethics?

          • David Hazan says:

            Leslie,

            The word “here” towards the end of my first reply to David Von Pein is a link to the source, where a Mark Gorton recounts having met Ed Epstein. I am afraid I can’t vouch for the source. At least not for the moment. But, I will try to look into it.

            As for your second question… I thought my tongue-in-cheek reply to you, along with my reply to Von Pein, where I tried to lay out how it is actually extremely probable that the suicide narrative is fictional, would have made my position clear. I believe GDM, who was known to be a company man, was singularly the most public danger to the LN story, and he had begun to talk…. Not necessarily to divulge secrets, but perhaps to get a last taste of the limelight telling untruths, which he had done so well for 14 years as the key official character witness who portrayed LOH as a disturbed individual highly likely to not only want to kill the president, but capable of planning and acting on it as well.

            I would like to add that, if he was indeed eliminated, I don’t think his “apparent suicide” would necessarily be a murder with others’ fingers on the trigger. For the likes of life long company man like GdM, suicide is their only means to protect their families and loved ones once they are told that they need to be eliminated.

            And, going back to the O’Reilly angle… I suspect you are correct in your conclusion that his “front door” lie is to legitimize the suicide lie… But, as a highly compromised Person, O’Reilly might have had to accept the insertion of this lie in to his Killing Kennedy book by his handlers from the same company GdM worked for. O’Reilly can be many things… But he ain’t no idiot…

          • Ronnie Wayne says:

            C’mon David, Leslie and I for that matter would like a source.

          • Ramon F Herrera says:

            [Ronnie:]

            “C’mon David, Leslie and I for that matter would like a source.”

            =================

            That would be a Mark Gorton. I just Googled it:

            http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=19273

          • David Hazan says:

            Ronnie,

            I am assuming our posts were in the same moderation cycle… But just in case I was not clear about where the link was (this site’s color scheme is not making words with embedded links apparent… Shows as just a lighter grey type) here it is spelled out:

            http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=19273

            I will take this opportunity to reiterate that I have no idea about the credibility of of the author of the account, or the veracity of the content. All I know is that Ed Epstein is still alive, and someone who is in this line of journalistic work could possibly have him, at the very least, confirm or deny this story.

          • David Hazan says:

            I have had a chance to look further in to Ed Epstein since my posts above, and the more I read and listen, the less credible Epstein is looking…

            In fact, further in the thread that I linked to above, Mark Gorton seems to have a change of heart as well. He says:


            “Since the time I started this thread, my thinking about Ed Epstein has evolved. I am now of the opinion that Ed Epstein is a knowing agent of disinformation. When I first met Ed, I knew very little about him or his background. At that time, I knew that he had written on the topic of the JFK assassination, but that was about all I knew. When we had dinner, I was somewhat puzzled by Ed’s seeming lack of interest in the JFK assassination. He came across as someone who had not paid much attention to the assassination in the past 20 or 30 years. Although he said that he thought the CIA was behind the assassination, he seemed unable to elaborate on why he thought that or who at the CIA was involved. At the time, I wrote off his lack of interest and clear thinking as a product of someone who was not familiar with some of the information which came out in the last few decades, and I also assumed that his high degree of contact with James Angleton had confused him.

            I have another friend to whom I have explained my views about the Coup of ’63. As a weird coincidence, she also knows Ed Epstein. She sees him a bit socially, and she told me that Ed was writing a book about the Cuban angle for the assassination. Based on my conversations with this friend, she kind of knows that LBJ was behind the assassination, so she asked Ed if he thought that LBJ was behind the assassination, and Ed said, “yes”.

            I then later found out that Ed had been speaking publicly about the JFK assassination being a pro-Castro operation: http://jfkfacts.org/…assin/#comments His comments about Oswald being in league with Castro were completely contradictory with what he told me and also my other friend. In addition, the fact that he is actively talking and thinking about the JFK assassination discredits my previous benign assumption about him being uninterested and out of date with the JFK assassination, so the only explanation that properly accounts for all of these facts is that Ed is a knowing agent of disinformation.

            Ed being a knowing agent of disinformation would also be consistent with his false attacks on Terry Reed when Compromised was released. (See Defrauding America p 431-432 for this tidibit.) And some of the other posts on this thread also point out a series of other actions taken by Ed over the years that have served the purpose of spreading misinformation. ”

            http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=19273&page=2

          • Palm Beach County [Florida] Sheriff’s Office Death Investigation Report….

            http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/death2.txt

          • Ronnie Wayne says:

            Sorry David. Our posts must have been crossed of I flat missed your mention of Gorton/the EDU link. Thanks to you and Ramon for posting it. There is some really interesting reading on the rest of the page also. In particular two posts below Gorton’s site founder John Simkin quotes “Cram made it clear that Epstein, worked with James Angleton, was part of a disinformation campaign.” Cram was a CIA agent brought out of retirement to find out “what the hell was going on” with CI during Angleton’s reign.
            The only book I have of Epstien’s, or have read, is Inquest, but it’s been many years. I recall it seeming informative to me at the time.
            Also on the page Jim DiEugenio is quoted as believing he was CIA from the start.
            And, I believe it was Bernice Moore or Dawn Meredith who though Inquest, as his first book, may have been ‘legit’ so to speak to establish his credibility. (paraphrased)

        • Michael Hogan says:

          David Von Pein wrote:

          So, you think Jeanne DeMohrenschildt lied through her teeth when she told investigator Thomas Neighbors that her husband had tried to kill himself FOUR separate times in the year 1976?

          Did the alleged “conspiracy” and “cover-up” stretch all the way to Jeanne DeMohrenschildt….?

          Of course not.

          http://digitalcollections.baylor.edu/cdm/ref/collection/po-jones/id/329

  2. Ramon F Herrera says:

    “O’Reilly’s JFK Reporting Was Impossible. I Know Because I Was There”

    http://www.newsweek.com/2015/03/20/oreillys-jfk-reporting-was-impossible-i-know-because-i-was-there-312336.html

    =============================

    Both O’Reilly and Epstein used to be ardent pro-conspiracy investigators, and both changed their mind. Their similarities end there.

    O’Reilly. Extreme Conservative. Insults and attacks anybody who dares to have an opinion different from his. Calls them “pinhead”, Lee was “a low, low rung” which makes his viewership smile with pleasure. This is known as schadenfreude.

    Epstein: Liberal, ergo tolerant. If you have any doubts about how he is a classy gentleman who respects opponents just read his words here:

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/biographies/oswald/hollywood-history-the-debate-over-jfk/

    As far as success, monetary and otherwise based on intelligence, theirs are reversed.

  3. David von Pein may want to recall the “suicides” that were reported due to many of the individuals killed by LBJ’s hitman Mac Wallace. Some of those “suicides” were dubbed as impossible to commit by a person wanting to kill himself. Why these people were killed by Wallace is because they would have caused serious problems for LBJ. Makes for an interesting comparison to the deM case.

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